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Back by unpopular demand...

As per suggestion (and because my being a jerk should not be the cause of any else's unhappiness), I thought I'd try a new thread and see if I can get some help understanding.

I confess I can't see the appeal of these old, beat-up Fender basses. What is it? I've listened to them carefully, and at least my ear can't hear anything exceptional. They certainly weren't made of the best tone woods, or by master luthiers, so even new they were deservedly inexpensive.

If the tone ages like fine wine over the decades, maybe I lack these Golden Ears, but I'd be amazed if anyone could really hear this. And certainly they aren't visually impressive - the finish is worn off, they have dings and scratches and gouges and cracks. The paint has faded and discolored.

Now, I know there has to be something to it, because I can look on e-bay and see that these things are fetching prices that would make Jens Ritter or Mike Tobias or Vinnie Fodera envious.

Maybe you need to be a nostalgia buff? I wonder what any of those famous luthiers could get for a "relicked" bass that they cranked out for cheap, then stone-washed it. Do you suppose they could advertise it as "just as authentically mistreated as an old Fender"?

(And I'm really sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes. Hey, I'm well aware that my own choice is generally regarded as not too bright. Maybe my defense is the same as anyone else's: This is what I like.)
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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/26/2007 11:47 AM

Jens Zastrow (3706) wrote:

Basically, I am a HUGE fan of Fender basses and guitars but I have never actually owned one. I understand the allure of a well worn vintage Fender and can empathize with their owners. However I think that too many people have been brainwashed into believing the marketing/collector's hype regarding Fenders. Sure an old Fender can sound different than a newer one... even electrical components age and have an effect on sound, but to say it's better or worse than either a newer Fender or BrandX bass is purely subjective.

As far as relicing.... I have a little diatribe of that on my "Rant" page:
http://jz63.com/bass/rants.html
It's where I let the old codger in me speak his mind. ;-)



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/26/2007 12:10 PM

Paul Warren (15310) wrote:

Jens, your rants page should be required reading for forums like AB etc. It's a great read. I especially liked the rant about 'relic' finishes. That has to be one of the stupidest practices I've ever heard of.



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/26/2007 5:40 PM

Bruce Huntington (2750) wrote:

I enjoyed reading your Rants. Nice job.



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/26/2007 6:51 PM

Bill Jones (5886) wrote:

I went to your "rant" page...soooo true. Nicely done.

Bill



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/26/2007 9:40 PM

WILLIAM HULSEY (25112) wrote:

Nice rant page!

Bo



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 7:32 AM

Morten Sickel (11976) wrote:

Well ranted, Jens!

M.



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

4/5/2007 7:40 AM

Craig Ditchfield (8305) wrote:

:) Well put Jens!!


Gumby

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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/27/2007 7:31 PM

Shane Hogan (147) wrote:

I love Fender because they invented the electric bass guitar.
I dislike Fender because they stopped innovating in 10-15 years and their basses show this.

Some reasons I dislike Fender are.

-The logo is mostly what you pay for.
-They only have 20 frets.
-The Pbass has a whopping 1 pickup.
-The old body shapes.
-I have a Crate knock off Pbass that probably sounds just as good or could sound just as good with cheap mods. Any company can do this.
-Everybody loves them for no real reason I get the same tone on my knockoff pretty much, which is not anything near what I want.
-No real humbuckers.
-So many models with little variety. Why I ask you, why?

Just listen to the Ric used on Tom Sawyer and hear howmuch better it is for



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 6:11 AM

Inactive Member wrote:

he doesn't use a ric on tom sawyer.



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 6:15 AM

Inactive Member wrote:

the ric was retired by then. he started using a wal bass, i think, or a steinburger(sp?)and after that it was his jazz bass exclusively after that.i'm not sure what he used on sawyer but it wasn't the ric.





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 6:37 AM

Inactive Member wrote:

i met him once. said hello and that was that.





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 5:14 PM

Shane Hogan (147) wrote:

It's a live version. Go to music.aol.com and search for rush then watch the Tom Sawyer video. It's definetly a Ric.





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 7:47 PM

Inactive Member wrote:

one live cut maybe. but it wasn't recorded using the ric.





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 8:28 PM

Inactive Member wrote:

he never used a ric on that song. it was long retired, it's most likely the jazz. prove me wrong and i'll bow to you for the next year!!!i'm almost 100% sure .





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 8:35 PM

Paul Warren (15310) wrote:

I have a DVD with clips from the studio. He was using the jazz to record Tom Sawyer. He would use various basses live, including the Ric. I saw them live in 1978.





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 9:32 PM

Inactive Member wrote:

hey



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 7:16 AM

Maurice Carr (37594) wrote:

....-They only have 20 frets.
-The Pbass has a whopping 1 pickup.
-The old body shapes.


Add to that - The most recorded bass in the music industry.

Mo



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

3/28/2007 5:27 PM

Flint Cowden (2941) wrote:

And probably the only bass that will increase in resale value if you carve your initials in it.



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

4/5/2007 7:59 AM

Peter Sillery (19002) wrote:

Is that only because the P-Bass has been around the longest though? Since about '51 isnt it? Or is it because it performs the best in the studio?

Gibson and Rickenbacker didnt start making electric basses until the mid '60 (I think) and the Jazz didnt appear until 1960 therefore the P-bass had a nine year head start on the J-Bass in the recording studio.

I like Fenders. I used to own a Precesion but sold it recently to finance the purchase of a G&L, which by the way I feel are a far superior bass guitar due to the many different tone options available on them.

Just my opinion though........

D Silbag!





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

4/5/2007 8:03 AM

Peter Sillery (19002) wrote:

Oppps! I meant Gibson & Rickenbacker didint start making basses until the mid-50's!!!!!

Silly me!

D Silbag!





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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

4/5/2007 3:24 PM

Maurice Carr (37594) wrote:

...Is that only because the P-Bass has been around the longest though? ...

No doubt that's part of it.

My impression from the various history buffs on this subject is that the P Bass was very simple in its tonal arrangement and the sound tech in the studio had pretty much total control apart from how the bass was played ( finger style etc )

P Basses do sound nice when recorded and a few P Bass owners who have other instruments will use the P Bass in the studio and their other basses live. There was an artist ( forget who ) whom I saw on You Tube saying that as well.

A mate of mine has a P Bass sitting around doing nothing and has offered it to me many times to play around with. So I just might grab hold of it for a try.

I used to have a 73 Jazz which I bought brand new. That was nice and I regretted selling it as well as my Holden Wasp 200 bass amp.

Mo



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Re: Back by unpopular demand...

4/6/2007 5:59 AM

Kasra Saboktakin (7772) wrote:

that's the point. there's something which made it the moset recorded electric bass in the history of music ;)

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